Anyone running E85?

[Dfris]

I have done most of the performance bolt-ons I can. I need an exhaust (including downpipes when they come out), and inlet tubes still, but will be moving to get more out of this motor still.

I am thinking of running E85, but have literally 0 experience with it. Is anyone running it currently? If so, thoughts? If not, is there a reason? E50 or anything in the general topic is welcomed information!

 

[miff01]

My only experience with E85 was in my 2013 FX4 with the 5.0L v8. We don't have that formulation on the west coast but had a chance to try it on a cross country trip. I waited until the tank had less than 5 gallons of 'regular' gas before filling. I reset the trip odometer and set off for the next 500+ mile stretch, or so I thought. My MPG dropped from 18.5 (all I-80 freeway) to less than 15 and it was gutless on acceleration. I never put another drop of that formulation in that truck.
Perhaps Ford has done some magic with the EcoBoost engine so it won't have such a big falloff, but I doubt I will even test it out.

 

[Dfris]

My only experience with E85 was in my 2013 FX4 with the 5.0L v8. We don't have that formulation on the west coast but had a chance to try it on a cross country trip. I waited until the tank had less than 5 gallons of 'regular' gas before filling. I reset the trip odometer and set off for the next 500+ mile stretch, or so I thought. My MPG dropped from 18.5 (all I-80 freeway) to less than 15 and it was gutless on acceleration. I never put another drop of that formulation in that truck.
Perhaps Ford has done some magic with the EcoBoost engine so it won't have such a big falloff, but I doubt I will even test it out.

Thanks for thebfirst hand info! I wonder how much changes in ours...

So, flex fuel and the ethanol it contains is more resistant to combustion. This makes it more ideal for forced induction engines and very much not as good for NA. The ethanol, like alcohol, causes the air to cool and thus becomes denser. So we have cooler, denser air in the engine. This is heavenly for boosted motors, but you would think also for NA as well.....unfortunately it also means ethanol contains roughly 33% less energy than gasoline. So an all motor build would need a way beefier fuel system to make up that difference. This also means that no matter what you do, you will be loosing great deal of fuel economy. The benefits though are really noticeable in turbo setups because of the cool running nature of it; but it's all in the name of power.

It can increase power beyond 93 octane fuel, but it will never be more efficient.

I know conceptually how it works and why, but I don't know anyone running it and wondered how dramatic it was in any direction.

 

[Fozzy]

@miff01
Anything with forced induction can be made to love E85, without it not so much.

I have a buddy that does E85 in his Explorer ST. Its a rocket ship. His biggest complaint about running it is its hard to find at the full E85. You have to test every station you use and continually test them. He also has a tune for E50 so he can dilute the tank a little. He runs it on his SxS and it runs like a raped ape. I just think it's too big a pain in the but to deal with since it's not at every pump. But the power gains if set up right are crazy good. He swears by ZFG Racing.

 

[miff01]

Thanks for thebfirst hand info! I wonder how much changes in ours...

So, flex fuel and the ethanol it contains is more resistant to combustion. This makes it more ideal for forced induction engines and very much not as good for NA. The ethanol, like alcohol, causes the air to cool and thus becomes denser. So we have cooler, denser air in the engine. This is heavenly for boosted motors, but you would think also for NA as well.....unfortunately it also means ethanol contains roughly 33% less energy than gasoline. So an all motor build would need a way beefier fuel system to make up that difference. This also means that no matter what you do, you will be loosing great deal of fuel economy. The benefits though are really noticeable in turbo setups because of the cool running nature of it; but it's all in the name of power.

It can increase power beyond 93 octane fuel, but it will never be more efficient.

I know conceptually how it works and why, but I don't know anyone running it and wondered how dramatic it was in any direction.

@miff01
Anything with forced induction can be made to love E85, without it not so much.

I have a buddy that does E85 in his Explorer ST. Its a rocket ship. His biggest complaint about running it is its hard to find at the full E85. You have to test every station you use and continually test them. He also has a tune for E50 so he can dilute the tank a little. He runs it on his SxS and it runs like a raped ape. I just think it's too big a pain in the but to deal with since it's not at every pump. But the power gains if set up right are crazy good. He swears by ZFG Racing.

Good to know, thanks for the information!

 

[Dfris]

@miff01
Anything with forced induction can be made to love E85, without it not so much.

I have a buddy that does E85 in his Explorer ST. Its a rocket ship. His biggest complaint about running it is its hard to find at the full E85. You have to test every station you use and continually test them. He also has a tune for E50 so he can dilute the tank a little. He runs it on his SxS and it runs like a raped ape. I just think it's too big a pain in the but to deal with since it's not at every pump. But the power gains if set up right are crazy good. He swears by ZFG Racing.

The reason it popped into my head is because the station closest to my house has it. I also am a junkie for more power. I'm just trying to do everything I can without breaking it open lol.

I assumed we can use it, but honestly I haven't checked. I thought most newer applications can utilize it.

 

[1warmtremor]

The reason it popped into my head is because the station closest to my house has it. I also am a junkie for more power. I'm just trying to do everything I can without breaking it open lol.

I assumed we can use it, but honestly I haven't checked. I thought most newer applications can utilize it.

Did you ever run E85? I’m real curious as my JB4 has a tune for E85 gas but not sure if we can run E85 without changing anything in the fuel system. I don’t have E85 near me but it’s not too far out of the way.

 

[MLBTremor]

The more ethanol in gas the less mileage you will get.

 

[1warmtremor]

The more ethanol in gas the less mileage you will get.

I’m not really looking at gas mileage, more looking for performance gains. I’m stock outside a JB4 tune/CVF titan V2 IC/BOV. I do have a widow muffler and 3inch pipe waiting for install and thinking about the S&B intake (again, had on my old truck) but really it seams more about the fuel you put in with these trucks. If I can run E85 safely @ 2.60 per gal. I get better performance and cheaper gas. Maybe it will be a wash with mileage vs price per gal.

Edit: (it’s a 37$ savings on a full tank compared to 93, surely that will offset the mileage loss)

 

[Escape Hatch]

I’m not really looking at gas mileage, more looking for performance gains. I’m stock outside a JB4 tune/CVF titan V2 IC/BOV. I do have a widow muffler and 3inch pipe waiting for install and thinking about the S&B intake (again, had on my old truck) but really it seams more about the fuel you put in with these trucks. If I can run E85 safely @ 2.60 per gal. I get better performance and cheaper gas. Maybe it will be a wash with mileage vs price per gal.

Edit: (it’s a 37$ savings on a full tank compared to 93, surely that will offset the mileage loss)

I would think an E85 tune should be available? Wonder off the fueling system is up to tap with the needed additional flow. I would also anticipate quite a power bump over 93. Running back of the napkin math but with E85 you get less mileage and pay less but over the run would save roughly $25 a tank. This assuming $4.50 a gallon for 93 versus 2.75 for E85 with the assumption of 18 mpg on 93 versus 14 on E85.

 

[FaKtor34]

There is a E85 tune available, but your mileage will drop drastically, and to be honest the 93 octane performance tune numbers are fairly close to the E85 it wouldn't be worth the difference to me. Ethanol inherently leads to problems in fuel systems and engines regardless of the type and to me it wouldn't be worth it period for those reasons. I know that's my opinion and I accept that, I just don't understand why anyone would want to run it.

 

[Dfris]

Did you ever run E85? I’m real curious as my JB4 has a tune for E85 gas but not sure if we can run E85 without changing anything in the fuel system. I don’t have E85 near me but it’s not too far out of the way.

No, I actually never went any further with it (yet) for a number of reasons. The main reason you get way less milage is the amount of E85 that has to be injected compared to others (it has faress less enegery). So, 1st reason, idk if our injectors are capable of pushing the volume I would need. 2nd reason, kind of coincides with the 1st, the fuel pump has to be able to do the same thing. Lastly, I haven't looked at our fuel lines and E85 holds water. So if they're not all synthetic lines they will corrode and potentially cause a large amount of damage to the fuel system.
I know our trucks don't come from the factory set up to run E85, so I'm assuming at least 1 or 2 of these things are why. Just haven't got into it to find out. On a side note, the guys I know running E85 get 5 to 8 MPG.

 

[1warmtremor]

Good to know, what about mixing the two? Running maybe 70% 93 and 30% E85? Would this be a better solution? I’m running Map 5 ( +6psi peak boost) on my JB4 with 93 and it’s fast as Fuck! But it does recommend 30% E85. But from what I understand that’s if my truck is stock. (Not that mine modded out as I only have IC/BOV)

 

[1warmtremor]

No, I actually never went any further with it (yet) for a number of reasons. The main reason you get way less milage is the amount of E85 that has to be injected compared to others (it has faress less enegery). So, 1st reason, idk if our injectors are capable of pushing the volume I would need. 2nd reason, kind of coincides with the 1st, the fuel pump has to be able to do the same thing. Lastly, I haven't looked at our fuel lines and E85 holds water. So if they're not all synthetic lines they will corrode and potentially cause a large amount of damage to the fuel system.
I know our trucks don't come from the factory set up to run E85, so I'm assuming at least 1 or 2 of these things are why. Just haven't got into it to find out. On a side note, the guys I know running E85 get 5 to 8 MPG.

Oh and I only need my stuff to work for the next 5 years since I’m forced to trade it in due to work. Lol so longevity is also not a big concern unless we are talk within 5 years.

 

[Dfris]

Good to know, what about mixing the two? Running maybe 70% 93 and 30% E85? Would this be a better solution? I’m running Map 5 ( +6psi peak boost) on my JB4 with 93 and it’s fast as Fuck! But it does recommend 30% E85. But from what I understand that’s if my truck is stock. (Not that mine modded out as I only have IC/BOV)

I haven't looked at mixing really, so I can't speak to it extensively. The same concepts would apply just in proportion. I would first look at how far you can push the fuel pump and injectors. It's more feasible that a 30% is possible.
The tune is saying to run that because of detonation/knock issues when you run more boost. By adding E85 you will cool the air ratio and in turn the combustion chamber as a whole, so you can run higher boost without fear of other systems being beaten up and failing.

The other thing you can look at is running water/methanol injection. This does the same thing but doesn't require the fuel system changes. The only concern is that methanol is extremely flammable and has a flame that is almost invisible, so you would need to be careful. The other option, believe it or not, is windshield washer fluid. Some are actually a blend of water/methanol, the lower the freezing temperature the more methanol.

 

[1warmtremor]

I haven't looked at mixing really, so I can't speak to it extensively. The same concepts would apply just in proportion. I would first look at how far you can push the fuel pump and injectors. It's more feasible that a 30% is possible.
The tune is saying to run that because of detonation/knock issues when you run more boost. By adding E85 you will cool the air ratio and in turn the combustion chamber as a whole, so you can run higher boost without fear of other systems being beaten up and failing.

The other thing you can look at is running water/methanol injection. This does the same thing but doesn't require the fuel system changes. The only concern is that methanol is extremely flammable and has a flame that is almost invisible, so you would need to be careful. The other option, believe it or not, is windshield washer fluid. Some are actually a blend of water/methanol, the lower the freezing temperature the more methanol.

That’s good info, we’ll with the CVF IC and get and S&B intake. Maybe I’ll be fine on 93 on that tune. I will play with 20-30% E85 when I’m near it. (Gas station that Has it) See if I notice a diff. As for now I’ll leave it as is finish my exhaust and ad the intake. If I start having any issues I’ll drop it back down to Map 3 (+4 psi peak)

 

[1warmtremor]

Well, thank God for a car accident yesterday. I had to go a very different route to work and discovered a E85 gas station that’s not that far away from my work! I did a 60/40 93/E85 and the truck is running great. I can really feel the diff, it pulls harder. I’ll run this for a while and see what happens

 

[Escape Hatch]

So you are running E40 mix roughly at a 98 octane. Curious what your MPG goes to.

 

[1warmtremor]

So you are running E40 mix roughly at a 98 octane. Curious what your MPG goes to.

Yeah, I should have reset my computer but I was too excited to find E85 on my normal route I couldn’t wait to play. I will reset this morning and see what happens I hear E85 tanks but maybe E40 won’t be bad. I’m wondering what would happen if I added VP racing Octanium to the E40 mix.